Timeline strategy with my first grow

[rama777]

Yo! I’ve got 9 Grimm truffles going here (first grow). I’m on day 13 from sprouting, and day 5 after the first transplant. They’re a cross of Cinderella 99 and White Truffles. I’m in a 3×3 tent with a 400 watt MH, moving to a 600 HPS when appropriate. I’m actually only going to grow 4 of these out in 5 gallon pots of organic soil, which some people definitely do successfully, though I understand plenty of people argue to not do more than 2 in a 3×3 space. In the future I may only do 2, but I’m definitely going to attempt 4 this round.

Anyways, my plan is to top once, SCROG them and hopefully take a cutting from each at some point to start potential mothers (going down to one after I see the results of the grow..).

I’m looking for some advice and tips on what to expect in terms of a pre-flower timeline. Since it will be tight, I imagine I should just top once, probably leaving 3 nodes after doing so, unless someone has any advice for a different topping point for some reason?

I imagine I could do that sometime within the next 7 days?

Also, any guess as to a range of time that I can expect between now and when I should flip to flower? I’ll be bending and probably tying things down after topping, hoping to create a good even canopy for the SCROG, but I’m a bit in the dark about knowing what kind of growth I should be looking for before flipping. I’m told these should be about a 2x stretch, but I also don’t know how that works out with the SCROG technique. Is the stretch factor about the same or will it be somewhat reduced by the LST and scrogging?

I’m not sure what my limiting factor is going to be with 4 plants in a 3×3. Is it height before switching to flower or in my context will it be the number of nodes that should be my guide before flipping? I guess what I’m asking is will I be more limited horizontally or vertically? I will say that so far the node spacing is pretty damn tight, which is why I’m questioning wether or not height or number of nodes will be the more critical factor for determining when to flip.

Okay enough for now, thank you for any advice!!

[rama777]

[mrgrowit]

You’re definitely off to a great start as they look excellent for day 13 since sprout! Whenever I have plants that size that early on I know things are really dialed in.

You have 8 plants there but talk about only 4 being in that 3×3; what will happen to the other 4 plants? Are they Regs so you are assuming 50% males that you will kill off?

Yes you should be able to top within the next 7 days. 4 plants in a 3×3 is definitely doable; it will just be a very fast veg time before flipping. You may be able to flip around day 30 or else you might overgrow the space. By then, you might not even see preflowers. I’ve had some plants take upwards of 6 weeks in veg before showing preflowers. I’d flip whether they show pre-flowers or not.

Yeah you’ll definitely be able to control the height/stretch after flip if you’re training and doing SCROG. Hard to explain exactly when you should flip but many people attempt to fill all the SCROG squares and then flip – but that’s optional really.

I believe I covered everything but you had a lot of questions so let me know if I missed anything or if you have other questions.

[rama777]

Cool, I appreciate the help! They are feminized seeds actually. I started with 9. One had weird growth all the sudden which I believe was just a bad seed. I’m going to select the best 4 out of these 8 and cull the other 4. I also plan to take a cutting from each of the 4 that I grow and then if I’m super happy with any of them I’ll have a mother on hand.

Since you’re kind enough to be willing to help, maybe I’ll just post a picture update in a few days and see if they’re ready to top and then take it from there. I haven’t ordered my final pots yet. Planning to use 5 gallon living soil pots from grassroots. I’d be willing to bump that up to 7 gallons if you thought it would boost yields by 7% or more on what will be a relatively short veg period. I’m using nutrients from Terrabiotics. I doubt many people have heard of them. I use their products for my no-till annual farm which is what I do for a living. They’re water soluble organic dry mixes that have humates, fulvic acids, lots of microbials and various rock and sea derived nutrients.

[mrgrowit]

Generally speaking, the bigger the grow pot, the easier it will be when growing organic. I do 7gal at the minimum and am now running 10gal pots for my organic plants. Also the 7gal in your case will result in less waterings and will probably result in faster growth (so shorter veg like it seems like you’re going for). Impossible for me to tell you, ” it would boost yields by 7% or more” since there are so many variables.

[rama777]

Makes sense. I have a feeling that with my particular line of nutrients that it will be a bit easier to manage in somewhat smaller pots versus using dry meals, which is actually all I use on my no-till produce farm. I could be wrong. I’m not aiming for any particular veg time, rather my goal is to fill out the tent just right, which I suppose will be dictated by my strain, training and the general growth trend going forward.

[rama777]

Day 15. Ready for their first feeding?  I’m about 2 days away from their second watering after transplanting. So it’s either start the nutrients in two days from now or start them in another 6 days from now.

Also, because I’m growing four plants in a square tent and I suffer from some back pain, I’m thinking about not using a scrog screen. If I were growing only two plants I probably would try it.

With more hands on time spent with LST, can I achieve more or less the same canopy control as I would with a net? I realize tops might sag eventually, in which case I could call in the yo-yo clip troops when needed.

[mrgrowit]

Which brand of soil are they growing in? I apologize if you mentioned but I missed it. Many bagged potting mixes have enough nutrition in it for the first 30-40 days of the plant’s life. For example I often use FoxFarm Ocean Forest soil. If I start the plants in a 5gal container, I’m usually doing my first feeding around day 30 since sprout. If I start in a solo cup then transplant to 1 gal then transplant to a 5 gal, well everytime I transplant into that larger container, that fresh soil has nutrients in it, so I’m not doing any feedings during that time and may actually do the first feeding around day 40. It also depends on growth.

Yes you could definitely get a nice even canopy while filling the grow space without doing the SCROG technique. That’s mostly what I do these days. I just use stakes for support when needed.

[rama777]

<p style=”text-align: left;”>Cool thanks. I’m trialing Coast of Maine and Terrabiotics soil. Both should have adequate food for 30 days now that you mention it, plus they’ll be transplanted again in the not too distant future.</p>
Planning to top them in about 3-5 days, then transplant them into 5 gallon pots a few days after that.

After that I’m estimating another 21-25 days of veg, flipping to flower when they’re somewhere around 48-54 days old. But we’ll see how growth goes since I need to keep 4 plants reasonable in a 3×3!

[rama777]

I’m reading a lot and looking at different grows to help me decide where I want to top. I’m leaning towards topping above the 4th node. That will create 8 main tops correct?

Sounds logical enough. But where I’m hung up is wether or not I should count the first true leaf as the 1st node, or if that gets skipped over? And when I say first true leaf, we’re referring to the one that lacks the multiple tips, but is still the first serrated leaf, just directly above the cotyledon? I am a farmer for god’s sake. Technically I know it’s the 1st true leaf, but I’m just making sure that holds true in the cannabis world.

I saw a skilled grower who actually trimmed off the branches that were growing from the first true leaf node. Is that common practice? My first node branches are looking pretty solid. It’s hard to imagine that I would trim them off. So really the question boils down to wether or not the first true node shoots are typically keepers/main tops, or if they get sometimes get removed for some reason.

[rama777]

[rama777]

Sorry one last comment even though I’m sure you understand my confusion 😉

On a particular grow that I’m looking to possibly mimic, he tops above the third node, in his words. However, I am certain it’s actually the 4th node, and then when he does his first bottom cleanup he cuts the first true leaves and the shoots from that 1st node. I can see that with his strain, the first node shoots are not vigorous like mine, so it totally makes sense. At this point my 1st node shoots appear to be rather solid. So either I’ll be keeping them as tops based on my strain, or someone will educate me that the first node shoots are never main top keepers?

[mrgrowit]

I like topping at the 4th node like you mention you might do. Yes, 8 main branches would come up as long as LST is done effectively afterwards. If you have a set of leaves at the bottom of the stalk with no branches also coming out, don’t count that since that pair of leaves doesn’t have branches there too.

I’ve done the technique you mention where the first node branches are removed and the others are kept. Totally up to you if you want to do that or not. Sometimes the first sent of branches don’t develop as nicely as anticipated and end up being removed later on anyways, but if yours look like they are going to take off, keeping them might be a good idea. Hard to tell you for sure since there are so many variables.

[rama777]

Thanks man, I really appreciate it!

[rama777]

Day 27, plants are about 6-7” tall when the tops (6 per plant) are standing up after light training. Slightly over fed but not alarmingly so I don’t believe. No burnt tips. A few lightly hooked leaves and probably a bit dark on the maturing fan leaves. They’ll be transplanted into 7 gallon pots tomorrow. I’ll have an infra red gun to check the leaf surface temperatures soon. I’ll put them under the 600watt HPS for a day to record measurements of the lst throughout the day at different light to canopy distances to get a feel for how tall I hope to have them to finish at. This will help me to approximate a target height before flip.

In my context of a cold climate winter grow, in order to maintain a good temperature in the tent with the air cooled HPS, I’ll be constantly extracting and intaking a fair amount of air. I’m guessing that the intake air will be around 64 degrees on average. This will probably create some chaotic differences through the volume of the tent. This has me thinking that I should run my leaf temps at the tippy top of my canopy at a somewhat higher than optimal temperature in order to not have the soil become too cold. Is that sound logic? It seems to me that there has to be a sacrifice made at both the level of the soil and the canopy. Which one is the more important factor I wonder? There needs to be soooo many more scientific studies made on growing these plants :))

 

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